Rules for 2013

[mr2sc]

this may be premature, but I'm curious...in the past, I was in SPB. Now, I 'think" I'd end up in Super B..
So, previously, I didn't require a window net, but am I correct in my understanding that now I would require one (like Prepared classes used to?)?

Makes it a bit awkward for a street car with full interior, a roll bar and not a real cage...

Just wondering...

thanks

You can wear arm restraints instead of a window net.

Ugh! PITA...but thanks for the reply Les

[blindsidefive0]

this may be premature, but I'm curious...in the past, I was in SPB. Now, I 'think" I'd end up in Super B..
So, previously, I didn't require a window net, but am I correct in my understanding that now I would require one (like Prepared classes used to?)?

Makes it a bit awkward for a street car with full interior, a roll bar and not a real cage...

Just wondering...

thanks

Send me an email and we can chat about your car - there's a good chance you would move from SPB to a Touring class rather than a Super Class or Prepared Class.

[mr2sc]

thanks Nick...you've got mail

[dinoracer]

....
The current worksheet listing these proposed changes can be found here.

......

Current revision here; added some detail as to consequence, and my current position on each.

https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B4lyVo ... kFqdTgtSmM

Again, this is changes proposed to the CURRENT 2012 rule book, not the re-write proposal also being developed. A copy of these proposals has been provided to the authors of the proposed re-write, and I expect most of these will be incorporated into the re-write, either before iot comes to a vote or after as part of the details process..

Thanks Tom

[nateh]

A few of these would probably still have to be considered even if we adopt all or part of the proposed new rule set. E.g., Fred's proposal for dropped events.

[Mario Fallas]

Personally I think this whole thing is a PITA of colossal proportions, so here is my plan, I'm going to show up, let you guys tell me what class my car belongs in and run it, if it's competitive it's all good, if not, I'll say god by! my point being that this game is expensive enough as is and this rule changes can add up to thousands $$ in order to remain competitive just because somebody had a bright idea that comes without funding. This is looking more and more like SCCA and NASA by the second and I have no use for them at all.

[brucesallen]

Mario- not so. Your car will be classes more correctly for more competitive classes regardless which mods you choose to make or not make.

[horizenjob]

Mario- not so. Your car will be classes more correctly for more competitive classes regardless which mods you choose to make or not make.

Don't you need a small displacement and/or turbo motor to be competitive in the SP classes? I'm still finding this to be confusing... I need to pick a motor soon and the frame starts going together in the next week or so...

Am I too worried about this? If I pick a motor can I depend on the torque fudge factor not changing for a year or more?

[Mario Fallas]

Thanks Bruce, my comment was out of frustration from the experience I had recently with NASA as I tried to enter a TT with them , somehow according to the form I read my 1986 POS corvette would have been in the same class as the C5 ZO6 vetts running well over 400HP with the usual mod$ of a $o called $treet cars, so now I start reading COM forum about headlights or the lack of them and it started to feel like NASA again and in my mind they're as cold as my refrigerator, not a club, no camaraderie, no helpful officials , just give me the money and good luck. COM is a different animal and I love it, I just hate to see it go the wrong way if this darn thing gets too complicated, at the end of the day I just want to race without all this confusing rules and still be competitive .sorry for the long winded post.

[breakaway500]

"at the end of the day I just want to race without all this confusing rules and still be competitive"
I fully agree with this statement.
I like the current rules of Prepared: count your cylinders,add one class for forced induction and no nitrous allowed. Not much to worry about,and I certainly don't need a calculator and slide rule to figure it all out.Easy to tech as well.
If the new proposed rules are fully implemented,my Atom will be classed with formula race cars,where it does not stand a snowballs chance in Hell of being competitive.
It may look like a formula car,but it is too heavy,too wide,and too tall to ever compete evenly with an actual race bred car. I can hold my own in PB..but certainly the Atom is not dominating the class!



Power to weight and how a car "looks" (open wheel,two seater) might be fine to class vehicles for drag racing,but not road racing.

The Atom has 6" of ground clearance because it was designed to be driven on public roads. A high roll center is the result of such a compromise.Not ideal for handling.
A formula car has 1.5" of ground clearance because they are race cars,designed with on track performance as their prime directive...

[McMahonRacing]

" NASA again and in my mind they're as cold as my refrigerator, not a club, no camaraderie, no helpful officials , just give me the money and good luck "

COM rules are essentially NASA rules & yes, they don't work all that well w/ NASA either ... the rules do take time to learn and manage to an advantage as there are some pretty heavy hitters ..... as w/ anything it will be the ones who can afford to manage the rules to their advantage that will dominate, leaving those of us w/o deep pockets in the back ....

I have run w/ NASA in the past, HPDE and found them to run a nice program, individules & instructors were quite nice, maybe I was lucky in the fact I knew a bunch of folks there already & and had comunicated via e-mail w/ the regional officals prior to arrival, either way, I found it was a great experience and in my mind very similar to COM .....

COM over the years has helped many folks move up to NASA ( ex. Factory Five guys ( Dave, Dave, Jim, Mark, John, etc ), Kurt, Jake, Fuschwanze's, myself & Dad as of 2013 ), talking w/ all these guys they have had nothing but good things to say regarding NASA but, they are for the most part on the wheel to wheel side of things and do admit the TT guys can get a little loopy at times .....

" go the wrong way if this darn thing gets too complicated, at the end of the day I just want to race without all this confusing rules and still be competitive "

Always liked this about PA myself, figure now if I need to deal w/ all the rules in COM, might just as well deal w/ them in NASA and do a little wheel to wheel racing, what was once simple get's complicated, is what it is .....

I really do like COM, it is great place w/ many many great poeple, NASA is definalty not COM but, it is not all that bad either if you give it a chance ......

[blindsidefive0]

If the new proposed rules are fully implemented,my Atom will be classed with formula race cars,where it does not stand a snowballs chance in Hell of being competitive.

Which model do you have, and have you made additional modifications from its as delivered configuration?

[breakaway500]

Well..this beats working on putting a transaxle in a car (barely..)..so here goes:

Super class classification sheet: 2007 Ariel Atom2 "300" (they never came close to 300hp from the factory)
Actual dyno numbers taken last year:
220whp. x .66=145
200wtq. x .33= 66
so...145+66= 211 corrected wheel "power"

Weight of the Atom fueled with me in it= 1590lbs. (1350+240)

so..competition weigh (1590lbs) divided by 211 corrected wheel power= 7.53

1400-1600lbs has a weight correction factor of -1.6 so..7.53-1.6= 5.9

I run race rubber. (no add or subtract)

I am rear wheel drive,2wd. (no correction factors)

I am open wheel,non single seater...so 5.9 minus 1= 4.9 to 1 corrected power to weight.

That makes my corrected power to weight <6,which puts me deep in to SU by my calculations.

Even if I ran DOT tires (+.5)less than 275 width(+.5),it still would land me in SU with a 5.9 corrected power to weight.

The Atom on skinny street tires is about 10+ seconds slower than Bruce at NHMS...more at the Glen. A LOT more..

[blindsidefive0]

Thanks for the response - looks like you appropriately classed your car in Super. However, that's probably not your best option under the new system.

You could potentially run in T100 under the latest proposal (we shifted all the points down 10 so that T100 now goes up to 109 points) - for reference the stock c5z is now bottom of T90 instead of bottom of T100. With those specs and dyno numbers, you would start with 105.5 points. Because of your competition weight (-4 points) you could run some decent rubber and stay in Touring.

[breakaway500]

Thanks Nick,but I will be keeping the PB class letters on the car and will run in that class till it no longer exists...and then take up whittling..