ST Question - Brakes

[blindsidefive0]

New LSD core is on the list but hasn't been installed yet.

To get the most out of SP I would have to jump up in power slightly, or add downforce or both.

Screw more power/downforce - get that diff in there. Inner wheel spin from the Z has become a recurring nightmare of mine. That and being unable to completely disable driving aids on the GT-R.

[dtlemoine]

I tried the CL Brakes C6E pads for the last event, those were fantastic.

Hell ya - my co-driver Dave had those on his M3 last year. Basically no visible wear at all after a couple events.

This year we are running PFC-06's on my 325i and are also very happy with those.

Yep, yep. The CL6's I ran last year at WGI and NHMS on my E36 M3 were fantastic (and they weren't even the 'E' enduro model). 4 track days, which some pretty serious braking everywhere at NH and at the bus stop at WGI and they held up strong, never faded, and the wear was almost nothing. I assume your 'E' pads wear even less.

As Nick said this year we're running the PFC 06's on an E36 325i and they're amazing as well. Sintered metal seems to be the best of all worlds. Plenty of cold stopping power, and they don't fade even at temps WELL above 1000 deg F. I think we've got almost 10 days on the pads this year (some of which were co-driven) and they still look like new.

From what I understand the PFC 06s are VERY similar in bite/fade/ware to the CL pads, at a slightly less expensive price (at least for the BMW). Duct up your front rotors, power flush with some ATE Blue or 200, and you should be good to go.

[cfossum]

It has a heavy rear bias and uses ABS to bring the bias forwards as required.

Wow. To rely on ABS for routine braking while beginning with a non optimal brake bias? I'll withdraw my earlier recommendation.
-Carl

[savage217]

You could easily run in ST with stock brakes and not overheat. Of course running long duration's out on track is the real problem. I still overheat my m3 brakes with pfc06's. I need to get some aftermarket ducting to help. I suggest you run stock brakes with very good pads and ducting. I do not see you overheating your brakes on a time trial run. Do not forget that NHMS is awful on the brakes. Such slow speeds and many hard brake applications are a recipe for brake abuse. At WGI and Monticello I never had any problems at all with my brakes, other than the fact I wish I had more brake.

Also there is no way that car can do 15's as it is. Even with those big ass tires, I find it nearly impossible to believe. Mid to low 17's is definitely in the car as it sits.

[Chrispy]

I have no delusions about running 15's, the car is far too heavy for that as it sits. I know I left time on the table as it was only my first event at NHMS, definitely some places I noted that I could be going faster, all told maybe 1.5-2.0 seconds out there on a perfect lap.

I'm going to keep it in SP for the rest of the year and see what happens. This is more of an educational year for me, so it doesn't really matter what class I'm in. Next year could be a different story.

Top priority is going to be to get the diff installed so I can get up the turn 4 hill without inside wheel spin on the stickies.

[paultg]

Top priority is going to be to get the diff installed so I can get up the turn 4 hill without inside wheel spin on the stickies.

and safety gear I hope.

[Chrispy]

Top priority is going to be to get the diff installed so I can get up the turn 4 hill without inside wheel spin on the stickies.

and safety gear I hope.

The brakes are safety gear! But yes I'm looking for a roll hoop and a harness bar for now.

[WillM]

Hi Chris!

Welcome to the club. You did a great job behind the wheel, especially for your first event, and were competitive on day 2 - awesome! I would say that your instructor did a great job, but I'd hate to give Troy too much credit.

1000* peak temperatures isn't that hot. My fronts hit 1400*. If it is outside the temperature range of your pads, than go higher. I think that the question isn't what the peak temperatures are, but what the temperatures are just before going into the braking zone. Either way, brake ducts should help a lot, as would larger or thicker rotors.

Since your car is a daily driver, I would suggest going with a set of daily pads and a set of track pads. In order to be able to just swap pads (and not rotors) at the track, go with pads from the same manufacturer that are compatible with one another. There are likely pads from Carbotech that will fit those needs, and as an added bonus, even the most extreme race compounds from Carbotech are rotor friendly, and the pad dust wipes right off.

That said, the camber adjustable control arms are not legal in ST, and it is possible that the "giant tires" aren't legal either, depending on how "giant" the tires are in relation to the fenders. If that is the case, go with whatever brakes you want. If anything, larger rotors and brake ducts.

I'd likely start with brake ducts and more aggressive pads, such as the Carbotech XP12.

[Chrispy]

Thanks Will.

So Camber plates are allowed in ST but the adjustable control arm is not allowed? Fair enough.

The pads I've been running are a dedicated track pad and are good for 1800F. I didn't have any fade at the event and the pads are nice in that no bed-in is required so it makes it easy for me to switch back to street pads. My front to rear brake balance was probably a little off and I should go to a more aggressive front pad to balance it out.

Surprisingly there is no proper brake duct kit available for the 370Z yet. I've seen a couple of home brew attempts but they weren't particularly effective. The main hangup is getting a proper hub duct to get air in to the center of the hub and rotor.

Doesn't ST and SP have the same tire requirements? I know I'm right on the edge of what would be considered legal, but the tire does tuck behind the fender under compression, and should be right on the limit of the rule. I would actually prefer to run one size smaller but I got a deal on the monster tires. As they are I can't really use all the tire anyway as they are a bit too big for the rims.

[CP]

Note that you may not be getting your current pads into their "sweet spot" and thus are not experiencing their full potential. I'd think that only getting them to 60% of what they're rated for is not enough.

[Chrispy]

Note that you may not be getting your current pads into their "sweet spot" and thus are not experiencing their full potential. I'd think that only getting them to 60% of what they're rated for is not enough.

1000F was the rotor soaked temp, I'm sure peaks were higher.

I checked the temperature/friction curve for these pads and they are pretty linear, they have peak torque in the 800F to 1200F range but more or less full friction from 200F on up.