ST Question - Brakes

[Chrispy]

I've read the rules several times and I think my interpretation is correct even though it works against me in this case.

X.4. Running Gear
A. Brakes
1. Updating and backdating of braking system is allowed within the same manufacturer regardless of model as long as it is
completely bolt-on without adapter plates or brackets. Brake pad/lining material is unrestricted and brake lines are
unrestricted.

I'm taking this to mean that you can change brake parts provided they are bolt on parts as sold on another model vehicle by same manufacturer and that they bolt onto the competitor's car without modification. Use of 3rd party brake calipers would not fit into this classification - correct? For example if the GT-R brake calipers and rotors were a bolt on fit for the 370Z then I could use those, but my AP Racing calipers would not be legal, hence a bump to SP.

SP rules make no mention of brakes so I assume that brakes are unrestricted?

This is the one item that seems to bump my car from ST1 to SPB.

[breakaway500]

I was wondering why you were running in SPB..but the aftermarket calipers do indeed land you there. Have you tried the stock setup for track?

[blindsidefive0]

The stock setup on the Z's tends to overheat pretty quickly. However, I suspect you can get away with it if you make sure to have top of the line pads, fluid, and get fancy with some brake ducting.

Street Touring X.4.A.3 - Brake Ducts are allowed.

[Chrispy]

The stock brakes were giving me some weird ice-mode issues, but subsequent analysis has determined that it was more of an ABS and brake bias issue than anything else. The stock calipers were also prone to overheating and boiling the brake fluid, which is what sent the Road & Track test car into the wall at VIR. At the time it seemed as though $4K for the brake kit was a cheap investment if it kept me away from walls

With enough ducting and the right pads I could probably make the stock brakes work, but the AP's are so awesome it would be difficult to give them up.

[cfossum]

I thought it was car and driver that crashed the Z. My memory sucks though...
Try the stock calipers with race pads. More heat into the rotor, less into the caliper. ABS off, or pull the fuse.
Keeps you in ST too, where you can serve up a can o' whoop-ass.
-Carl

[blindsidefive0]

I thought it was car and driver that crashed the Z. My memory sucks though...
Try the stock calipers with race pads. More heat into the rotor, less into the caliper. ABS off, or pull the fuse.
Keeps you in ST too, where you can serve up a can o' whoop-ass.
-Carl

Not a bad idea - just make sure to test the brake bias after yanking the ABS fuse(s)/relay(s). Sometimes the same system will control ABS and brake bias (on newer cars littered with driving aids) and you can get into some trouble if it's unplugged. I don't THINK (more of a guess, really) this is an issue with the Z, but probably worth trying before heading into T3 at NHMS on your out-lap.

[Chrispy]

Not a bad idea - just make sure to test the brake bias after yanking the ABS fuse(s)/relay(s). Sometimes the same system will control ABS and brake bias (on newer cars littered with driving aids) and you can get into some trouble if it's unplugged. I don't THINK (more of a guess, really) this is an issue with the Z, but probably worth trying before heading into T3 at NHMS on your out-lap.

Yes, unfortunately that is the case on the 370Z. It has a heavy rear bias and uses ABS to bring the bias forwards as required. Gives very effective braking but pulling the ABS fuse leads to horrible rear lockup unless you manually rebalance the system by installing a proportioning valve or use a far less grippy rear pad.

[paultg]

Sounds like you should embrace SP and go crazy with the rest of the car.

[Chrispy]

I thought it was car and driver that crashed the Z. My memory sucks though...
Try the stock calipers with race pads. More heat into the rotor, less into the caliper. ABS off, or pull the fuse.
Keeps you in ST too, where you can serve up a can o' whoop-ass.

You're right it was C&D.

The stock rotors are a 30lb slab of cast iron so they should be able to sink quite a bit of heat I would hope.

Are you hinting that you want me out of your class Carl? LOL

[blindsidefive0]

Ouch - ya, then I would just go stock calipers, stock rotors, ATE Super Blue (or whatever your preferred fluid is), and some serious brake pads. Other than that, is the sport/NISMO package an option (bigger discs), or do you already have that?

The good news is that if you can make it through NHMS in July, then NJMP-Lightning in August should be a bit easier on your brakes. There are 2 "big boy" braking zones, but plenty of time in between for the brakes to cool off (relatively speaking).

BTW - just looked up your NHMS results. Great pace...you would be a beast in Street Touring.

[Chrispy]

Sounds like you should embrace SP and go crazy with the rest of the car.

When I decide to give up driving it on the street that will be the plan

[TroyV]

There is more in the car as it sits. I say keep the car exactly the way it is and run it in SP. I'm betting you can find three more seconds at NH. It was only your first time there.

[Chrispy]

Ouch - ya, then I would just go stock calipers, stock rotors, ATE Super Blue (or whatever your preferred fluid is), and some serious brake pads. Other than that, is the sport/NISMO package an option (bigger discs), or do you already have that?

The good news is that if you can make it through NHMS in July, then NJMP-Lightning in August should be a bit easier on your brakes. There are 2 "big boy" braking zones, but plenty of time in between for the brakes to cool off (relatively speaking).

BTW - just looked up your NHMS results. Great pace...you would be a beast in Street Touring.

Thanks.

Yes, I started with the sport package which has bigger rotors and fixed multi-piston calipers. The Nismo has the same setup.

I tried the CL Brakes C6E pads for the last event, those were fantastic.

According to the caliper temp strips the calipers reached 460F and the rotors were a little over 1000F.

[blindsidefive0]

I tried the CL Brakes C6E pads for the last event, those were fantastic.

Hell ya - my co-driver Dave had those on his M3 last year. Basically no visible wear at all after a couple events.

This year we are running PFC-06's on my 325i and are also very happy with those.

As for those temps - that's "warm". Maybe it is best to keep the current setup in SP? What else have you done to the car?

[Chrispy]

All the other mods are ST approved as best as I can determine.

- Sway bars
- Adjustable shocks, replacement springs
- High flow cats
- Cat back exhaust
- Oil cooler
- Cold air intake (stock MAF and throttle body)
- Adjustable camber arms
- Big ass tires

New LSD core is on the list but hasn't been installed yet.

To get the most out of SP I would have to jump up in power slightly, or add downforce or both.