Thompson Motorsports - first outing
Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
I just spent this afternoon watching the NASA group run this track from different vantage points (but not behind the wheel). Overwhelming opinion from some friends running is that it is more like a large autocross track, with spots that everyone likes and spots everyone hated. Looked a lot like NHMS with not as severe transitions, but REALLY would be nice if they put a bowl at least one of the 180 turns. Times for some of the faster groups were around 1:15.
John F
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962porsche
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Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
when I went up to Thompson a few weeks ago and my friends and I walked the track it did look to be a track that will be more fun with a low HP car more then a high HP car . you only have a long straight to really stretch the legs of a high HP car .
but even though there are 3 180 turns they still looked like they are different apexes to them .
like the 2nd 180 looks like it's a late apex turn and the 1st is a center apex so even though they are 180's they would not all just be the same .
but for wheel to wheel racing there also looked to be some good passing areas too .
allot of people say they don't like NHMS . I am not one of them I like that track ! I'm not a fan of Nascar 1 &2 I tend to like the chicanes instead as it adds a little some thing more to the track .
liking a track I think has more to do with the feeling you get inside your self about driving .
but even though there are 3 180 turns they still looked like they are different apexes to them .
like the 2nd 180 looks like it's a late apex turn and the 1st is a center apex so even though they are 180's they would not all just be the same .
but for wheel to wheel racing there also looked to be some good passing areas too .
allot of people say they don't like NHMS . I am not one of them I like that track ! I'm not a fan of Nascar 1 &2 I tend to like the chicanes instead as it adds a little some thing more to the track .
liking a track I think has more to do with the feeling you get inside your self about driving .
Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
John George in-car from Sundays NASA race
John F
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962porsche
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Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
personally there are a couple of different line I would have tried . but not knowing where the car was behind may have opened the door for the other driver to get under him .
Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
Here is my vid from Thompson. First time on sticky tires (borrowed - 1 session only), so it was a learning experience.
I did 3 days with NASA. Interesting club, but lacks a lot of what COM brings. I really like their time trial format. I think COM should try it some time.
I did somewhere between 3 and 400 miles at the track. It take some time to learn. I was still finding time on my last session. I chewed through probably 60% of my NT01s in the 3 days. It eats rubber right now.
Troy asked me for a review. This is what i gave him:
First two sessions were clumsy. The track is tight and a little weird. Surface isn't grippy, and not much rubber down. Can't see other people's lines. The track also has varying degrees of camber within each turn. Lots of bitching about it being an autocross with walls. I don't agree at all.
After the 1st session, i hated it. The harder you drive, at first, the closer you are to flying off the track. It didn't seem to flow. It's real easy to get pinched, and go off. If someone lost brakes, there are tons of places that would be very dangerous.
We all got together after each session and discussed. We all argued the lines. This helped tremendously. I would highly recommend that the classroom be required for each run group immediately following each session. Just a powow session to discuss the track, passing zones, etc. Nothing formal. The guys that have been to the track before can help the noobs, etc. Also, if someone is driving like a moron, everyone else can let them know how to resolve the problem next time.
Learning the track is the most dangerous part, by far. That's when people were going off. Once people learned it, it was a lot safer.
BUT, I tend to learn tracks quickly. Not the case for most drivers. Some were there 3 days and looked like retards on the track. It's not an intuitive line, like watkins glen. The lines are unusual for most turns, and there isn't a clear "ideal" line in many turns. It kind of reminds me of turn 3 at NHMS. There are 60 different ways through that turn, and that's how it is for a bunch of turns at Thompson. So, it's extremely technical. Maybe the most technical track i've driven. Therefore, there will be a lot of frustrated drivers. Student groups will be train city. Instructors will be out of their minds. Each student needs 20 minutes of discussion after each session.
By the end of the day, i really was enjoying the track. Once you get the hang of it, and find where the grip is, it's a fun track. It got better each time i drove it. As i got faster, it flowed better and better. Meanwhile, pavement was coming apart. I've heard they are fixing that.
Passing is a bitch. At NASA, there were maybe 30% of guys that were cooking around the track. The rest were slow. Passing zones are short, and require that the person getting passed has a big lift, and in most cases stays off line. The line is a lot like NHMS turn 10. A car needs to stay left to be passed on the right. That's how a lot of the straights are at Thompson. This requires serious effort on everyone's part, especially the noobs. Guys with big power are a major nightmare to fast drivers in slow cars. The big power guys go slow as hell through the turns, then floor it on the straight. Maybe COM will be different...
The track is rewarding to lighter cars. Very low power cars may have trouble getting out of the slower turns, but the miata type cars seems to excel.
There is currently NO blend line. I'm sure they just can't paint the fresh pavement. Entering the hot track is very dangerous. Cars are at high speeds where the pit out is. Pit out is not far from turn 1, so there isn't a lot of room to merge. There is a big blind spot. If a car is approaching, and you accelerate out, you can have situations where you don't see the car at all. It's absolutely paramount that drivers coming out stay far right all the way to turn 1 and take a tight line through 1. Every student had the tendency to set up for turn 1 coming out of the pits, which is very dangerous. I couldn't believe how difficult it was to get instructors to force this on the students.
Pit in is also a little risky. It's very important to get your arm up and signal pit in early, like turn 10. After 10, stay hard right through 11a and 11b. 11b is a hill immediately after a very fast right turn. It's blind, and high power cars get loose going over it. Plus, it's a typical 4th gear shift right at the top of the hill. Not a good place to pass, as you don't know where the track is ahead, while climbing the hill. If pitting in, maintain speed, stay hard right over the hill, and all should be good.
Passing should only occur after the cars are over the crest.
The padock sucks ass. Maybe it will be better for a smaller group (COM). NASA overwhelmed it. If you want some pointers on where to grid cars, etc, let me know. I'll tell you what NASA did. The racers all parked in the far paddock. It's pretty far away from the main paddock, which sucks. But, there isn't much for space elsewhere. - If we aren't renting the whole space, i have no idea where the trailers will go....
So, i can't tell you whether or not COM regulars will like it. COM has some fantastic drivers. Not sure if it's because the track is far from most NASA guys, but there seem to be a higher percentage of great drivers in COM than NASA. So, if NASA can handle it, I'm sure COM can.
Once the track works out the bugs, and gets better curbing and barriers, it will be great. I really enjoyed it. I like NHMS too though.
Gas stations are far. Like 15-20 minutes, which sucks. Hotels are far too. And the entry road to the bridge is loose gravel, which sucks. The bridge is one way, with a timed light (can't see over the bridge), which sucks. The food at the track reminds me of the food at a fair. Just fried junk food out of a truck.
Right now, if i had the choice between driving the two tracks, I'd pick Thompson. I've got a lot to learn there, which i find fun. NHMS is where i have all my bad habits to break, which makes me slow, which sucks.
-end
I didn't encounter any faster driver that didn't like the track. It seemed to be the slower ones that didn't like it. Maybe they had trouble learning it, which is why they were slower. I'd say that, by the end of the weekend, almost everyone I talked to enjoyed the track. So, if you didn't like it the first time, don't give up hope.
I did 3 days with NASA. Interesting club, but lacks a lot of what COM brings. I really like their time trial format. I think COM should try it some time.
I did somewhere between 3 and 400 miles at the track. It take some time to learn. I was still finding time on my last session. I chewed through probably 60% of my NT01s in the 3 days. It eats rubber right now.
Troy asked me for a review. This is what i gave him:
First two sessions were clumsy. The track is tight and a little weird. Surface isn't grippy, and not much rubber down. Can't see other people's lines. The track also has varying degrees of camber within each turn. Lots of bitching about it being an autocross with walls. I don't agree at all.
After the 1st session, i hated it. The harder you drive, at first, the closer you are to flying off the track. It didn't seem to flow. It's real easy to get pinched, and go off. If someone lost brakes, there are tons of places that would be very dangerous.
We all got together after each session and discussed. We all argued the lines. This helped tremendously. I would highly recommend that the classroom be required for each run group immediately following each session. Just a powow session to discuss the track, passing zones, etc. Nothing formal. The guys that have been to the track before can help the noobs, etc. Also, if someone is driving like a moron, everyone else can let them know how to resolve the problem next time.
Learning the track is the most dangerous part, by far. That's when people were going off. Once people learned it, it was a lot safer.
BUT, I tend to learn tracks quickly. Not the case for most drivers. Some were there 3 days and looked like retards on the track. It's not an intuitive line, like watkins glen. The lines are unusual for most turns, and there isn't a clear "ideal" line in many turns. It kind of reminds me of turn 3 at NHMS. There are 60 different ways through that turn, and that's how it is for a bunch of turns at Thompson. So, it's extremely technical. Maybe the most technical track i've driven. Therefore, there will be a lot of frustrated drivers. Student groups will be train city. Instructors will be out of their minds. Each student needs 20 minutes of discussion after each session.
By the end of the day, i really was enjoying the track. Once you get the hang of it, and find where the grip is, it's a fun track. It got better each time i drove it. As i got faster, it flowed better and better. Meanwhile, pavement was coming apart. I've heard they are fixing that.
Passing is a bitch. At NASA, there were maybe 30% of guys that were cooking around the track. The rest were slow. Passing zones are short, and require that the person getting passed has a big lift, and in most cases stays off line. The line is a lot like NHMS turn 10. A car needs to stay left to be passed on the right. That's how a lot of the straights are at Thompson. This requires serious effort on everyone's part, especially the noobs. Guys with big power are a major nightmare to fast drivers in slow cars. The big power guys go slow as hell through the turns, then floor it on the straight. Maybe COM will be different...
The track is rewarding to lighter cars. Very low power cars may have trouble getting out of the slower turns, but the miata type cars seems to excel.
There is currently NO blend line. I'm sure they just can't paint the fresh pavement. Entering the hot track is very dangerous. Cars are at high speeds where the pit out is. Pit out is not far from turn 1, so there isn't a lot of room to merge. There is a big blind spot. If a car is approaching, and you accelerate out, you can have situations where you don't see the car at all. It's absolutely paramount that drivers coming out stay far right all the way to turn 1 and take a tight line through 1. Every student had the tendency to set up for turn 1 coming out of the pits, which is very dangerous. I couldn't believe how difficult it was to get instructors to force this on the students.
Pit in is also a little risky. It's very important to get your arm up and signal pit in early, like turn 10. After 10, stay hard right through 11a and 11b. 11b is a hill immediately after a very fast right turn. It's blind, and high power cars get loose going over it. Plus, it's a typical 4th gear shift right at the top of the hill. Not a good place to pass, as you don't know where the track is ahead, while climbing the hill. If pitting in, maintain speed, stay hard right over the hill, and all should be good.
Passing should only occur after the cars are over the crest.
The padock sucks ass. Maybe it will be better for a smaller group (COM). NASA overwhelmed it. If you want some pointers on where to grid cars, etc, let me know. I'll tell you what NASA did. The racers all parked in the far paddock. It's pretty far away from the main paddock, which sucks. But, there isn't much for space elsewhere. - If we aren't renting the whole space, i have no idea where the trailers will go....
So, i can't tell you whether or not COM regulars will like it. COM has some fantastic drivers. Not sure if it's because the track is far from most NASA guys, but there seem to be a higher percentage of great drivers in COM than NASA. So, if NASA can handle it, I'm sure COM can.
Once the track works out the bugs, and gets better curbing and barriers, it will be great. I really enjoyed it. I like NHMS too though.
Gas stations are far. Like 15-20 minutes, which sucks. Hotels are far too. And the entry road to the bridge is loose gravel, which sucks. The bridge is one way, with a timed light (can't see over the bridge), which sucks. The food at the track reminds me of the food at a fair. Just fried junk food out of a truck.
Right now, if i had the choice between driving the two tracks, I'd pick Thompson. I've got a lot to learn there, which i find fun. NHMS is where i have all my bad habits to break, which makes me slow, which sucks.
-end
I didn't encounter any faster driver that didn't like the track. It seemed to be the slower ones that didn't like it. Maybe they had trouble learning it, which is why they were slower. I'd say that, by the end of the weekend, almost everyone I talked to enjoyed the track. So, if you didn't like it the first time, don't give up hope.
Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
Hi Jon,
Thanks for the insight. I will keeps these notes handy.
Also to John for his video.
Both are helpful in getting an idea of preparing for the new track.
I had a tough time learning Calabogie last year but felt much better the second day. Hopefully it will be the same at Thompson.
BB
Thanks for the insight. I will keeps these notes handy.
Also to John for his video.
Both are helpful in getting an idea of preparing for the new track.
I had a tough time learning Calabogie last year but felt much better the second day. Hopefully it will be the same at Thompson.
BB
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brucesallen
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Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
they have gas at the track.
Bruce Allen
The Greased Shadow
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Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
When i was there, they didn't sell anything lower than 98 octane.
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Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
to tell the truth I'm not seeing any of the things like food ,fuel and such as any problem !
they have things called fuel jugs / gas cans if your using good old pump gas .
food you can pack a little some thing your self in a cooler . you should have a cooler any way filled with fluids to keep your self hydrated .
they have things called fuel jugs / gas cans if your using good old pump gas .
food you can pack a little some thing your self in a cooler . you should have a cooler any way filled with fluids to keep your self hydrated .
Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
I agree. This type of thing is common for many tracks.
It isn't great for the guy who shows up in a small car. Not everyone tows their car to the track. Some have pretty small fuel tanks and can only do a half day on a tank.
The biggest problem with going to get fuel is how long it takes, and driving over the bridge (delay) and crappy gravel road.
I'm sure it won't take too long for someone to build a gas station nearby.
It isn't great for the guy who shows up in a small car. Not everyone tows their car to the track. Some have pretty small fuel tanks and can only do a half day on a tank.
The biggest problem with going to get fuel is how long it takes, and driving over the bridge (delay) and crappy gravel road.
I'm sure it won't take too long for someone to build a gas station nearby.
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brucesallen
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Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
WHen I was there at the SCCA Soft Opening they said they were working on the self service pumps to include street 93 octane. Not sure when to be completed.joncowen wrote:When i was there, they didn't sell anything lower than 98 octane.
Bruce Allen
The Greased Shadow
"It's all about the fast lap"
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Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
I was there for the vintage races this weekend and they had 93 for about 4.50/gal, not horribly overpriced.
Gordon Andrade
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Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
Especially for CT with the highest gas taxes in the area.Grippy wrote:I was there for the vintage races this weekend and they had 93 for about 4.50/gal, not horribly overpriced.
Jeff Wasilko
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On the Track: 1995 Miata #08
To the Track: 2007 Volvo 780
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Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
jeffw wrote:Especially for CT with the highest gas taxes in the area.Grippy wrote:I was there for the vintage races this weekend and they had 93 for about 4.50/gal, not horribly overpriced.
Amen!
Sam
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Re: Thompson Motorsports - first outing
when they up the fuel tax it was for the up keep on our roads .
how ever it went Into the general funds so now they are talking about bringing back tolls again to pay for road maintenance .
how ever it went Into the general funds so now they are talking about bringing back tolls again to pay for road maintenance .
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