NHMS 3 pics and vids

[breakaway500]

Doug,I don't go over the line in 6 for the same reason you don't. Power line in 6 (in my opinion) is not to cross the line during track out, and stay on the banking,applying full power with no issues. (Sorry to see you not make TT's... )
As far as 3,I stay on the power longer,brake later,turn in sharper,for a late apex (squaring off the corner) and head straight up hill ,full throttle..and track out.. as my power car bolts up three with no wheel spin IF I have no side loading.For me,taking the scenic route around 3 is 1/2 second slower and means trying to put the power down with side forces,which usually turns into a drift instead of foreward thrust. It's great to be able to watch everyones videos!

[savage217]

I don't know what it was but for some reason I changed my line in the braking zone for turn 3. I normally am over to the left further and turn in later. For some reason when driving the oval I kept creeping over to the right and turning in earlier. I've tried the Miata line through 3 and it just doesn't seem faster in my car. Now that I have data I can give it a try your way to see if it is any faster.

As for the Oval suggestion I would agree. It definitely makes sense. I felt like I didn't drive the oval that well in the time trial especially. During open track I felt like I got it down better but still not perfect. I actually ran a bit faster than the time trial on one of the last open track laps I did which is suprising considering that was about 30 minutes into the session and the tires were probabaly a bit on the hot side. I must have been faster in a couple areas. During practice the low line seemed to work well for me. I just didn't wanna stray too far from thjat during the time trial. I played around a little bit with the lines in open track but I still think staying low there is the fastest way around it (at least in my car).

For your bowl suggestion, are you suggesting I stay out wide to left when going over the hill? That would be opposite to pretty much every Miata line and more common for a higher horsepower car. If that is the case, Greg Loupis has been trying to get me to do that line forever. I will try it at the next event. I carried pretty good speed over the hill though, buttt it could be screwing me up for 8, ultimately slowing me down. Again, now that I have data. I can really play around and see what works best. I also realize I need to use the curbing more on the right for turn in of 11. I just keep hearing and seeing everyone braking wheels and suspensions there, which gets me a bit worried.

[dradernh]

Doug...Sorry to see you not make TT's...

Yeah, I'm really struggling at Loudon this year; if I'd realized I only had to show up to collect nine more points, I might have stayed. As it was, with two bad O2 sensors & the car not wanting to go, it seemed best to haul it back to the shop Saturday evening. Maybe in October the car will like the track again.

For your bowl suggestion, are you suggesting I stay out wide to left when going over the hill? That would be opposite to pretty much every Miata line and more common for a higher horsepower car. If that is the case, Greg Loupis has been trying to get me to do that line forever. I will try it at the next event. I carried pretty good speed over the hill though, buttt it could be screwing me up for 8, ultimately slowing me down. Again, now that I have data. I can really play around and see what works best.

I've seen Greg take that line & I don't understand it. Maybe it's that his car is more stable through T8 apex taking the wider line. I just have a slower section when I do that. Your car looked & sounded stable & hooked-up taking the shorter line, so I'll be curious if going Greg's way results in your going faster through there.

One thing that I'd find interesting is if you added lat g-force to your video. That would help give us an idea how hard your car is working in places like T6 track-out through T8 apex, as well as T11. I thought that the drive itself looked quite good.

[blindsidefive0]

Nick and I have been chatting offline about his video, but I wanted to post some comments here.

Oval - I agree with Cy on this one, stay higher for longer, and get on the gas earlier.

Turn 3 - I agree with Mark, turn in just a tad later and sharper to get full power down earlier. Yes, this effectively decreases the radius of turn 3, but it increases the radius of turn 4. Running the outside of turn 4 decreases the radius, which is the last thing that Nick needs when he's struggling to get full power down.

Turn 6 - I'm somewhere in the middle. I like to go about 1' beyond the white line to the right on track out of turn 6. It doesn't upset the car too much, but it allows for a wider exit compared to staying within the line. Also, Nick needs to pull the car back over to the left a bit to line up T8, unlike a Miata.

T8 -

I've seen Greg take that line & I don't understand it.

This is what Greg needs to do to maintain full power over the tree house. Unless you are WOT here, you need to tweak your line. I am constantly tweaking my line over T8 depending on the level of grip I have. If my tires are sticking, I can maintain WOT while hugging T8. If I'm on street tires or r-comps that are falling off (or still warming up), I will line up to the left of the T7 exit curbing to increase the turning radius at the top of the hill so I don't have to lift off the throttle (and still actually make the turn).

Two other things I've mentioned to Nick are T10 and T11b - a slightly more aggressive turn-in at T10 to loosen the rear might help point the car up the track so it doesn't wash out as bad at exit. Finally, at T11, I like to run all over the curbing at entry. By avoiding this curb, the entry to the corner is tightened, and it makes it harder to brake hard in a straight line since the car is constantly turning.

Nick mentioned concerns about running over curbs in T11 - does anyone care to share experiences of broken car parts through the North Chicane? I've heard of trashed suspension/wheels going too wide on exit (going beyond the exit bump/curb in the ditch), but I don't think I've heard of anything too bad by hitting the curb at entry.

[Andre]

Thanks for the compliments Dave/Nick. Can't wait to be in ST4

About the exit of 12, Chuck Tolley (didn't get to meet you but I will make a point to do it next event, love your car) got loose in front of me, the rear fell in that hole and it shot him to the left, straightening out the car and he kept going. No idea how he didn't break something. Very good save too, was really cool to watch.

[dradernh]

Finally, at T11, I like to run all over the curbing at entry.

Second/right-hand curb, Nick - car doesn't bounce around coming off it?

[savage217]

Nick mentioned concerns about running over curbs in T11 - does anyone care to share experiences of broken car parts through the North Chicane? I've heard of trashed suspension/wheels going too wide on exit (going beyond the exit bump/curb in the ditch), but I don't think I've heard of anything too bad by hitting the curb at entry.

I might have been mistaken but I thought this was an area where people were destroying wheels and braking suspension? Maybe I am wrong.

[blindsidefive0]

Finally, at T11, I like to run all over the curbing at entry.

Second/right-hand curb, Nick - car doesn't bounce around coming off it?

Hi Doug - it bounces around a bit loosening up the rear which is the point. Besides allowing for a wider entry and a straighter braking zone (resulting in later, harder braking), once the bump "turns" my car into the apex, I can go WOT well before the apex because I'm pointing in the right direction (not fighting understeer), and once I'm on the other side of the curb I've effectively widened the turn another 1-2 feet.

[CP]

Comments are welcome. The following video got me the pole a few weeks ago for the STU/SM2/SSM/EP race and was the fastest lap I've ever done at NHMS in my 99 Miata. It's a Spec car with no weight or restrictor plate (in STU trim) with used RA1s. I have been playing with a later lift and some light left foot braking going into NASCAR T1. The braking MUST be light, as too much makes the rear end unhappy but a little bit really helps to get the car pointed towards my apex in T2. (Note the red braking light in the center console) I don't usually take this line through T3 but plan to begin doing so moving forward if I don't have a car next to me. I got on the gas WAY earlier than I usually do at the entry/mid corner of T9 and was focussing on applying throttle asap in T11/12 or whatever number that last corner is. This is lap 3 of the session. First lap was farting around getting heat in the tires and brakes.

1:16.634

I find that I can brake later with the Hoosier SM6 but can't turn a faster lap versus the Toyos yet. I've got 8 heat cycles on my first set of Hoosiers so I'm still learning the fast way to drive that tire.

[imgon]

About the exit of 12, Chuck Tolley (didn't get to meet you but I will make a point to do it next event, love your car) got loose in front of me, the rear fell in that hole and it shot him to the left, straightening out the car and he kept going. No idea how he didn't break something. Very good save too, was really cool to watch.

Do you have video of that?

Nick mentioned concerns about running over curbs in T11 - does anyone care to share experiences of broken car parts through the North Chicane? I've heard of trashed suspension/wheels going too wide on exit (going beyond the exit bump/curb in the ditch), but I don't think I've heard of anything too bad by hitting the curb at entry.

I might have been mistaken but I thought this was an area where people were destroying wheels and braking suspension? Maybe I am wrong.

I'm thinking there is a hole just past the T-12 curbing that goes most of the way to China. As Andre mentioned I drifted "just a little wide" and I think most of my fillings got knocked out. When I got back to the pits I was glad to see I hadn't mangled the wheel. I frequently run across the curbing there and it is very bumpy but that trip was bad, hope to never do it again. Usually caused by chasing/trying to keep ahead of someone and going through T-11A/B too hot. When I get that section right I just kiss the curbing and get a nice drive onto the straight.

[Andre]

I don't have a video of it but that is the exact reason I'm getting a new gopro hero2 and rigging it to record every session on my next event. I really regret not having stuff like that on tape.

Also going down the entire turn 9 hill with my wheel pointing straight ahead would be nice to have. The corner worker happened to be looking right at me , he must have been amused.

[paultg]

Here is my TT video:
I tried to get the data into it but cant seem to get it sync'd correctly.

Still plenty of time out there and need to work on being more smooth. These were my best laps of the weekend though. Very happy to be within 2 seconds of the top finishers vs. the normal 4 seconds. Thanks again to all the fellow competitors (Rob R., Tom C., Troy V, etc.) who I tried to follow and learn from all weekend in Group 2. It was a blast.
Also thanks to Will M., Rob R., Dave W. and GTF for helping with the fender rolling after session one, and to Les for helping with an electrical issue / mis-fire that ended up being bad wiring with my 1.8 swap.

I'll work on the highlights of the practice sessions and try to get some of those up too. - Paul G.

[Chrispy]

I'm thinking there is a hole just past the T-12 curbing that goes most of the way to China. As Andre mentioned I drifted "just a little wide" and I think most of my fillings got knocked out. When I got back to the pits I was glad to see I hadn't mangled the wheel. I frequently run across the curbing there and it is very bumpy but that trip was bad, hope to never do it again. Usually caused by chasing/trying to keep ahead of someone and going through T-11A/B too hot. When I get that section right I just kiss the curbing and get a nice drive onto the straight.

Yep, that's the one that snapped my front right spindle and bent 2 wheels at the previous NHMS event. This event one of the Subaru's hit it with a rear tire and completely destroyed a wheel and fortunately nothing else.

I was very cautious of it this time around and barely touched the exit curbing. The entry curbing to T11 is much more gentle, I had no issue jumping all over that. Give you just enough time for the car to settle before braking for T12. I try to make sure I clip the inside curb at T12 as it does help rotate a little bit.

[betelgeuse]

Hi everybody First of all I would like to congratulate Bob C for taking down my track record in SSU. Nice driving Bob.
The reason I take that line thru T7/8 is I think it gives me a better angle into the braking zone for T9 allowing me to brake a little later. Another plus is you are turning slightly to the left under braking loading the right side tires setting up for the left hander T9. According to my Traqmate I was hitting just under 99 mph (98.85) in the C5Z. There is no way in hell I would be able to do that running the "Miata line".
Two people I have folllowed in practice running the same line as me are Laura Fleming and Nick Fontana. Both excellent drivers.
If you try that line and you have more than Miata power and you're slower.....You're just not doing it right.
My .02 cents
Greg

[ST1Ddope]

Turn 6 - I'm somewhere in the middle. I like to go about 1' beyond the white line to the right on track out of turn 6. It doesn't upset the car too much, but it allows for a wider exit compared to staying within the line.

If you have a softer sprung car you can get away with crossing that line. I can be full throttle to the left of the white line or full puckered to the right of the white line.

I've seen Greg take that line & I don't understand it.

I played with Greg's line through T8 most of Saturday and found about the same speed because of gearing, but I had a better, less exciting approach to braking for 9.

Two other things I've mentioned to Nick are T10 and T11b - a slightly more aggressive turn-in at T10 to loosen the rear might help point the car up the track so it doesn't wash out as bad at exit. Finally, at T11, I like to run all over the curbing at entry. By avoiding this curb, the entry to the corner is tightened, and it makes it harder to brake hard in a straight line since the car is constantly turning.

I had Nick F. in the car for a session on Saturday, T10 was a weak point for me and Nick corrected that by telling me to make the more aggressive turn-in. This got me approaching T11 with far more speed until I finally went mowing to avoid jumping the turtle at T11.