Championship - How to score?

[breakaway500]

So..whose on first base?

[WillM]

I'm glad this triggered some discussion! For the record, all I did was ask for input and didn't mean to imply my support one way or another.

I think the recent surveys have been GREAT and can't begin to tell you how excited the entire Board is about the incredible amount of responses we have received. All very good indications of a strong year for COM.

That said, if you like the communication, you'll likely love some of the programs we have in store for 2010. Our Prez and new Trez have been working hard behind the scenes. One thing most members probably do not know, is that the directors communicate with one-another daily. This may be our off-season, but my email inbox would say otherwise.

Concerning the Best-of-N approach, there have been some very good points made in this thread. I believe that the time-trial/competition is an important aspect of our club, and every time we move towards increasing competition, everyone benefits. With that in mind, if I were to be in a tight battle, I would not want to win solely because one or more of my competitors attended one less event than me. As much as we all love to hit the tracks, there are times when our schedules collide (weddings, family obligations, funerals, work, etc). Along those same lines, if a competitor couldn't make it to the first event of the year, and they are the type to want to compete for the championship, what is their incentive to attend the rest of the year? I believe this is why every competition club I am aware of uses a Best-of-N approach.

[boltonite]

With one event to go this season, here is how things WOULD look under a Best of N approach (where N = 1 event dropped):



In FP, Nate wins 67-59 under the current system, but Bruce appears to win under the Best of N ... but if attendance points count for all events, then Nate still gets his 2 attendance points for his dropped event and he still prevails, 60 - 59.

For the overall championship an ST2 guy is way ahead under the current system but under a Best of N it would be much tighter among the top contenders, with one event to go (note: dropped points adjusted to include attendance points).

Not sure this helps me at all, but I still think a Best of N approach makes for more competition without unduly penalizing 100% attendance or unduly benefiting those who miss one event. As we have all seen, $h!t happens and mistakes are made and a system that compensates for that is good imo.

-FF

[Mick]

I still like a best of N approach also.

My personal experience... going into the season I knew I wasn't going to make the July 4th event. I my mind that meant that a season championship was probably out the window before we even started. As a result I wasn't very interested in attending the other 7 events, I only did 3. This is the first season in 6 years that I didn't run every event.

[blindsidefive0]

I have been with the club since 2006, but have only done 1 or 2 events per year. My thinking was always that "some year" I'll get competitive, save up my vacation time, and hit up all the events. If I only have to run 5 or 6 events instead of 7 or 8, that's a big difference for me.

This year I am running 3 events (big year for me...) because I actually have a chance to place in SSGT. I know the situation is different (lack of drivers going to lots of events), but the motivation is similar - if I was 50 points out of 1st in the class at this point in the season, I might not be motivated to take another 2 days off from work for NJMP. Next year I hope to get to more events (hopefully 4 or 5), but the full schedule is just not attainable. If I miss an event or two early in the season, and I am statistically eliminated because a couple drivers are running all the events - I won't be as motivated to go to a mid-week away event late in the season.

Another example - F1 Boston has a go-kart league that I'm going to try to run this winter. They take your best 5 out of 6 events to place you in the "championship round" - I wouldn't event bother signing up if I had to attend all 6 weeks because I can almost guarantee I won't make 1 of the events (regardless of time of year).

Looking at time trial finishes this year -
TTs Completed 7 6 5 4 3 2 1
Number of Drivers 13 6 6 12 27 41 86

I would guess that scoring that allows you to be competitive running 5 or 6 events might be a good idea to get some of the 68 drivers who ran 2 or 3 events this year (like me) to step it up to 5 or 6. I would also assume that this would more than make up for any of the 13 full attendance drivers who choose to skip an event or two next year just because of this new rule. Really, if attendance is the goal - all proposals should be weighed in how effective they are of getting the 86 drivers (1/3 of all drivers) to attend more than just 1 event.

Finally, my personal take on away events - when having to "pick and choose" a few events, getting 2 extra points for away events makes them a priority (my 3 events are WGI, NH-4, NJ). Maybe giving 3 or 4 extra points might make it even more tempting. Having said that, 1 or 2 weekend away events would help a lot. 3 of the 8 events this year on on weekends, all of them at NH. I understand there are scheduling realities, and the club works hard for the dates on the schedule. However, I am taking 5+ days off from work (not sure about NJ travel yet) to make 2 away events - and that's pretty much the absolute most I can manage. If Tremblant or Monticello happened to be a Saturday-Sunday I might have been able attend (and be "competing" for 1st, not 2nd in SSGT).

[naschmitz]

After NJMP I'll have run 7 events with COMSCC and one other event that conflicted with NHMS-3 this year. Looking back, one thing that stands out is that it takes A LOT of vacation days to run 8 events -- I charged 15 days vacation in 2010 just for 8 track events alone.

Requiring 15 days vacation means that only serious addicts can be championship contenders in many classes. The only non-addicts who could attend 8 track events would be retired, independently wealthy, or own their business. If we could reduce it to 10 days vacation to be competitive for a championship that might mean a lot more people could play.

Just my $0.02. I have the addiction, but don't know if I'll have that much vacation to feed it every year.

[blindsidefive0]

I charged 15 days vacation in 2010 just for 8 track events alone.

So true - this is especially the case for away events. If you account for travel days, the away events alone would require 10-12 vacation days. Nevermind cost or points, I only get 15 days a year through work, sometimes a couple "bonus" days (which isn't bad, pretty standard). Using literally all my time off to compete is not an option.

[hondasi]

Hey everyone. I plan on runnig as many events with COM as I can next year. I don't know if I will have the time or $$$ to go to all the events. A best X out of Y points system would benefit me. Like others have said, it might affect attendance to tracks that are farther away. On the other hand it could increase attendance to more events close to home. Knowing that it you attend just a few more events the championship is within reach. Looking at it from a budget perspective, I would be in favor of a best X out of Y points system. It would also mean that if you are not going to run the entire season, you had better performe well in the events you do run. Just my opinion.

[cfossum]

Using literally all my time off to compete is not an option.

The lack of commitment from this younger generation is just shameful!

[brucesallen]

I would be interested in knowing how much more you would pay to have the event on a weekend-- to save vacation days. We have usually been booking weekdays during prime time weather season to save money.

[khissong]

I would be interested in knowing how much more you would pay to have the event on a weekend-- to save vacation days. We have usually been booking weekdays during prime time weather season to save money.

Is there a cost saving past on to the participants for attending week day events?

[blindsidefive0]

I would be interested in knowing how much more you would pay to have the event on a weekend-- to save vacation days. We have usually been booking weekdays during prime time weather season to save money.

It's tough to say - $600 would be too much, but maybe $100 more... For NH I probably wouldn't be willing to pay more for the weekend, especially since it's easy enough to just drive up for the TT day if needed.

What make it worth the trip would be a 3-day event at a track like MT. If you have a 2 day weekday event up there, you already lose most of a week of work when you factor travel days. This year there was the 7/4 3-day event at NHMS. I wasn't able to attend because of a wedding, but how well was that received (and what was the effect on club finances)?

[paultg]

Using literally all my time off to compete is not an option.

The lack of commitment from this younger generation is just shameful!

We are still married, you older guys are happily divorced via good attorneys.

[subsonic]

Using literally all my time off to compete is not an option.

The lack of commitment from this younger generation is just shameful!

We are still married, you older guys are happily divorced via good attorneys.

Well then, thats your problem right there... younger generation just expects to have everything. But don't worry, as you become wiser you will:

1- find good attorney, get unmarried
2- find the ex-wife of one of the guys that didn't have such a good attorney
3- quit your current job
4- sell you current track car
5- get a miata

[TroyV]

To hit on Something Nick mentioned...

A three day thing at any of the Canadian tracks would be totally amazing. I did the three days at NHMS this year, and I learned more about driving that track on the open day than ever before. So much so that my average lap times dropped by more than a second on the crap rubber. Getting an open day at Tremblant, Calabogie or Mosport would be absolute bliss.

I skipped NHMS3 to do a two day open format thing at Calabogie. I was the class leader up to that point. It was a hard choice then, and it would still be a hard choice now......Retain the class lead and increase my chances of winning for the year...or....pick up 600 track miles at one of the best tracks in Canada...