Clarification of Factory "Roll bar" acceptance

[sillyspheres]

SCDA should NOT be considered as a good example.

So Bruce, sounds like you have some resentment towards SCDA. Id love to hear about it some time.

[christine]

A big difference between COM and other clubs is that COM holds competitive events, and SCDA and BMW track events are specifically not competitive. They are drivers schools or high-performance driving events (HPDEs). Competition generally means more risk.

[Subw00er]

A big difference between COM and other clubs is that COM holds competitive events, and SCDA and BMW track events are specifically not competitive. They are drivers schools or high-performance driving events (HPDEs). Competition generally means more risk.

Thats interesting, scda and bmw dont time their events? I always thought com was considered a HPDE.

[jlwhorf]

I have looked into roll bars, and besides having to cut the interior up quite a bit, it will cost $1500 when all is said and done (no one local to me does this sort of work).

Thats interesting, scda and bmw dont time their events? I always thought com was considered a HPDE

I quess the big question you have to ask yourself is; "How much is you life worth". I know a chassis builder who could make you a custom cage that would fit the way you would want it to. Even on the street, good roll over protection should be considered. Many years ago, I was involved in a hard roll over in a lifted truck. I had a bolt together 4 point in cab cage and it most likely saved the lives of my brother, a good friend and myself. The three of us walked away.

I have run with both SCDA and BMW, and COM predominately has a higher level of performance and does run competition events in conjunction with DE.

Jonathan
900 PA

[christine]

A big difference between COM and other clubs is that COM holds competitive events, and SCDA and BMW track events are specifically not competitive. They are drivers schools or high-performance driving events (HPDEs). Competition generally means more risk.

Thats interesting, scda and bmw dont time their events? I always thought com was considered a HPDE.

I think SCDA allows lap timing, but BMW driving schools explicitly prohibit lap timers and stop watches. Also although SCDA may allow lap timers, AFAIK they don't have a contest for fastest lap.

Christine

[SSNH]

came across these today... i have no details about the event which caused this damage.

[christine]

That car is in about the same condition as the black C4 that endo-ed in T1 at the Glen a few years ago at a COM event (the driver was okay). That's what got me into a car with a full cage...

Christine

[brucesallen]

... or at least a real roll bar!

[christine]

The car at the Glen did have a bolt-in roll bar. It was just barely enough...

[christine]

Also, I don't know how the driver in the car in the above picture made out, but this is a prime example of why I don't believe in using a race harness without a roll bar. A harness holds the driver bolt upright, which would not be a good thing if the roof caves.

Christine

[turtlevette]

Also, I don't know how the driver in the car in the above picture made out,

over on the Corvette Forum they are saying he walked away with no scratches.

We are also having some discussion on the C3 forum about what happens in a street accident where you are rear ended, the rear of the frame buckles and pushes the roll bar forward into the back of your head potentially fracturing your skull.

[ryanthieme]

<snip>
We are also having some discussion on the C3 forum about what happens in a street accident where you are rear ended, the rear of the frame buckles and pushes the roll bar forward into the back of your head potentially fracturing your skull.

I can only speak to a low speed accident, but can say that having some padding is better than none. For no good reason, I never put the "street" pad I normally use back on to the rollbar after the Oct '04 NHIS track day. I simply removed the thicker SFI padding and got lazy about putting the other one back on (probably because the pad wasn't that thick to begin with and I never liked how it looked). A few months later I was rear ended while stopped for traffic and I hit the back of my head, up near the crown, on the bar. Got a pretty nice welt.

So now I just leave the thicker track pad on the bar. It looks like hell, but it's function over form.

~ryan

[therooster]

Hello, your head, or for that matter any part of your body, should never be able to contact the roll bar behind your head if you are properly restrained. Nor should there only be roll bar padding behind your head. Further if your head can hit the bar right now, how do you fit with a helmet? A roll bar/cage is part of a system. That system should included some sort of improved seating mount and a "head rest" of some sort to prevent this. Remember that any system is only as strong as its weakest link and if you are able to contact your roll bar/cage while properly restrained you better correct it, damn how looks.

As far as the rear frame buckling. I am assuming you are talking about the 63-82 corvettes? I have a wonderful book from GM circa 1978 that shows the proper cage design for these cars. They include rear cage struts that should prevent this from ever happening. If the frames are that weak I would hate to see what would happen in an accident without a cage, would the car just fold in half?

Chris A.

[turtlevette]

As far as the rear frame buckling. I am assuming you are talking about the 63-82 corvettes? I have a wonderful book from GM circa 1978 that shows the proper cage design for these cars.

is that the Chevy Power manual? I've got that one. If you have something else maybe i could borrow a copy.

If the frames are that weak I would hate to see what would happen in an accident without a cage, would the car just fold in half?
Chris A.

you ever see a corvette boneyard. It ain't a pretty site.

[ryanthieme]

Hello, your head, or for that matter any part of your body, should never be able to contact the roll bar behind your head if you are properly restrained. Nor should there only be roll bar padding behind your head. Further if your head can hit the bar right now, how do you fit with a helmet? A roll bar/cage is part of a system. That system should included some sort of improved seating mount and a "head rest" of some sort to prevent this. Remember that any system is only as strong as its weakest link and if you are able to contact your roll bar/cage while properly restrained you better correct it, damn how looks.

Not sure if this was directed at me but I will assume it was.

I have a seat that I swap into the car for track days so I'm below the rollbar. However for just everyday use, the stock seats are in the car and I drive around barcalounger style (reclined) hence the reason I suffered craniumus whackamus.

~ryan