Harness for Passenger

[modifiede30]

Looking for some input before I buy new harnesses. I'll be installing one for the passenger, and I'm unsure what to do regarding 2" vs 3" shoulder belts. I'm using the Schroth SHR system, which can be used with both size belts, but I know some are meant to be used with 2" (I'll be going with 2" for mine). The rules state that I need to make an allowance for those who want to use their own HNR if I'll be wearing one. However, if they don't have one and I have 2" belts it would seem unsafe. If I go with 3", it may not be ideal for anyone using the HANS which appear not to work as well with the wider belts. This seems to be a catch 22 for COM as well as other clubs with the same rules. Its unfortunate since each club is different in their view of running in solo groups, so I don't know for how long I might need to have a passenger seat installed if running in multiple clubs regularly now that my car is finally ready (sans the belts).

What typically recommended in this scenario?

[dtlemoine]

My personal view (not official club stance) is that HNR should ALWAYS be worn with 5/6pt harnesses. Atlanto-occipital dislocation (think... Internal decapitation) is a thing - your car's 3 point belt and airbag are designed to work together to keep this from happening, but when you restrain both sides of your body with the racing harness, your head and neck have nowhere to go. Even in low speed impacts you can seriously eff up your neck.

So, recommend 2" belts so they work with HNR, and make a strong push for your passengers to wear one, wherever possible.

[TXBDan]

Hans works fine with a 3" belt. It can be a little more of a pain to get lined up, buts its fine and proper per their standards and FIA.

https://www.hansdevice.com/blog/pages/f ... -questions
https://www.fia.com/sites/default/files ... n_spec.pdf

[gcranston]

So, recommend 2" belts so they work with HNR, and make a strong push for your passengers to wear one, wherever possible.

I believe the club has HNR that we use for HLRA. Is it possible for other members to use these when jumping in car with 5/6pt harnesses? I know the anchors may be an issue, but let's start with the HNR first.

[TroyV]

No one rides in my car without a HNR unless we are doing parade laps. I keep a helmet and HANS in standby for anyone that is ill equipped.

[modifiede30]

So I'll have an appropriate harness for HNR but I think having a 2" could be a problem so I'll go with 3". I just don't want my car to fail inspection because the safety equipment isn't the same for both seats.

[dtlemoine]

2" belts are actually picking up popularity regardless of HNR... The lap belts in many 3" setups are now coming in 2" because they fit the pelvis better, and offer safer restraint in a class.

https://nasaspeed.news/tech/safety/two- ... ed-safety/

Can't speak for others but Molly has a HANS (the original) and we couldn't get 3" belts to sit flush. Perhaps it can be done but if it's that challenging we're probably not the only ones who struggled.

I'm not sure I see a downside to 2" belts?? It's not like the 3" is offering any more strength, right?? Belts are designed to stretch, a proper 2" FIA certified belt has assuredly passed all the appropriate tests, with a side bonus of working seamlessly with every HNR on the market that I've seen...

[modifiede30]

I'm hoping the need for a passenger belt and seat is short-lived. I'd really like to put the petty bar in place which can't be done if I have a passenger. I'll be using a 2" because of the HNR but continue to be perplexed by the gap in rules and lack of clarity on this topic.

I really wish there was a rulebook item on this subject. Maybe given the recent request for rules modification, this could be one. I'll send a note on this to see what can be done to clarify.

[TXBDan]

For some reason I read your first post as already having 3" belts and asking if you had to switch to 2". Both work with Hans, but 2" are certainly easier to use with Hans. 2" lap belts are also hugely more comfortable than 3". There was a time when it was thought 2" shoulder belts were not safe without a HNR, but I'm not sure what the current state of thought is on that. That's why in my old car, I had 3" on the passenger side (cheaper and safe with or without HNR) and I had 2" on my side for use with my Hans.

[paultg]

Personally I’d buy matching belts, so 2” for both sides.
You can send a note to Cheif instructor after registering that you request an instructor who wears a Hans that works with 2” belts.
Just takes a bit of communication prior to the event and instructor assignments.

I remember when I started as a student in my older MX5 with stock seats & belts. I made them aware of the stock belts in case an instructor was uncomfortable riding in the car. I never ran into any problems at the event. - Paul G.

[modifiede30]

I ended up buying 2" for both seats. I figure it'll be easier to sell once I'm solo across all clubs and I install a petty bar so the seat won't be used any longer.