Advice on Miata rollbars

[cuppatea]

Hello COMSCC-ers,

I'm starting to think about getting a rollbar for my Miata (NA) and am wondering if there's anything important that I should look out for. I know the minimum specs from the COMSCC rule book and I've found 2 Hard Dog models which would fit my car (which has a Robbins glass window soft-top). One is the M2 Hard Bar Sport (w/ double diagonals) and the other is the M2 Hard Core (w/ double diagonals). Which do you think I should get and what's the difference?

And it would be great if y'all can give me any tips with the installation since I've never installed one before

Thanks,
Ivy

[Dave_G]

The Hard Dog roll bars are an excellent choice, and are by far the most popular roll bars for Miatas. Of the two you mentioned, I would recommend the Hard Core over the Sport, for two reasons: 1) it is made from larger (and stronger) DOM tubing; and 2) it is higher. Getting the roll bar high enough to fit a helmeted head underneath it is a very common problem in Miatas, and even if height is not an issue for you, it may very likely be an issue for your passenger. FWIW, I have the Hard Dog Hard Core in my Miata, and it's what I always recommend when people ask what roll bar to get.

[cuppatea]

Thanks Dave!

[paultg]

If you are concerned about height issues don't buy the hardtop versions, stick with the soft-top only version. They sit a bit taller and forward compared to the hard top models.

Paul G.

[timmmy]

I have the Hard Dog double diagonal in my 01 miata and am very happy with it. I am 6'2" and to be honest I barely fit in the car and mu head is barely legal with my race seat mounted basically on the floor. If you are tal you wil likely need to go with a very low race seat to be 'really legal' I tend to run with the soft roof up to avoid issues.

Install is pretty easy, took about 4 hours. The only special tool you will need is a foot long drill bit, 1/2" I think.

Haydn

[cuppatea]

No worries guys. I'm as short as they come (`~5'3"). Haydn, I'm not sure if you remembered me but you gave me a ride in your Miata during one of the instructor sessions at NHMS back in October last year. Height is not really a problem for me but I figured that I'd get the soft top one in case any of my instructors happen to be taller

Thanks for the installation tip. That seems quite quick compared to some of the reviews that I've been reading about people taking 10-12 hours... It's a tad pathetic but I don't even own a drill at the moment so I'll probably ask around for a bit once I get the rollbar.

cheers,
Ivy

[Dave_G]

There is a fair bit of dismantling of the interior that needs to be done to install the roll bar, but none of it is especially difficult. The instructions from Bethania Garage are mostly very good (though as I recall the bit about cutting the plastic side panels was a little confusing to figure out).

[timmmy]

Hi Ivy,

So sorry to hear I may have helped with your downfall into the world of MIata's, track days and autocross I do remember you and am happy to hear you were not scared away.

I would recommend having someone install your Hard Dog bar for you if you are not lucky enough to have a garage and tools. There are quite a few shops in southern MA and CT who do work on Miata's for track. My personal preference would be to give Lester at Apex a call to help you out. Lester is an Instructor for COM and drives a MIata or his Locost. http://www.apexautoeng.com/Apex.html

My install was probably faster than average as I have a pretty well setup shop and am very familiar with these cars. In your driveway with a set of axle stands, a good floor jack, a battery drill and a few other tools, including a handy helper who knows their stuff, you should probably budget a full weekend taking it nice and steady. While you are in there you should also install harness mounting hardware in the floors. Speaking of which, you should make sure you order the optional harness bar in the rear hoop.

Hope to see you and your boyfriend at the track next season, do I recall he had a Subaru or maybe a Honda?

[paultg]

It took my friend and I about 10-12 hous (over a weekend) to do the one I put in my last Miata. We were in a similar situation that is described above. I expect the next on to take 1/2 the time.

Paul G.

[Kai Noeske]

Haydn: Toyota Corolla, will bring a Honda next season... looking forward to seeing you!

[timmmy]

Haydn: Toyota Corolla, will bring a Honda next season... looking forward to seeing you!

Ah cool Kai, now I have been able to piece together who's who

[WillM]

I agree 100% with the Hard Dog Hard Core choice, preferably the double-diagonal. I believe you'll have to get one with harness tabs (to use as mounting point for the shoulder harnesses). There are a few tricks and tips to the installation. Keep in mind that the bar, once installed, will also act like a giant, sturdy, chassis brace. You don't want to be drilling holes and torquing the bar down unless the chassis is resting flat, yet the rear wheels need to come off to install the bar (I've done a few installs).

By the time you are done with buying tools, healing wounds, splicing wires that you accidentally drilled through, and figuring out which interior bit goes where (and where to cut it to fit around the new bar), you might find that you would have been better off having Les install the bar in about 1/2 a day. He does these installs quite often...and is on these forums, and will quite likely be the one inspecting the bar during tech.

If you go Apex, tell my car I said "hi".

Apex Automotive Engineering
61 Lacombe Street
Marlboro, MA
(508) 229-0090
http://www.apexautoeng.com

[breakaway500]

You may want to consider a Boss Frog as well. I have a double hoop Maxx for the additional height it offers,they are also available in double hoop regular,and single hoop models. Main reason for me going with the double hoop...I can reach back easily and raise/lower the top,unobstructed by bars,and it looks the "shizzle". (how 'bout that,Les.. )
Noteworthy...
"Boss Frog is the only Miata rollbar manufacturer who conducts destructive testing of their rollbars per SCCA guidelines. Details of these tests are available on Boss Frog’s website. Any manufacturer who states that their rollbars are "SCCA approved" is simply not telling the truth, since the SCCA creates its guidelines and does not approve (or disapprove) rollbars."

Nice to know..after all,you are not installing a rollbar for looks...

BF double hoop (and single hoop..)do not require a separate harness bar,another plus!
"Because of the unique design of the Boss Frog rollbars, it is possible to wrap the harness belts around the base of the rear hoop brace and be perfectly SCCA legal."



Lots of options available..wind blockers,pad kits,pad covers, stainless ( ) etc etc.

link to site.. don't forget to feed the frog... http://www.bossfrog.biz/Miata_Rollbars.html

I would suggest you pay someone to install whatever bar you purchase.NOT a fun job even for a veteran.

[cuppatea]

Wow! Thanks Will & Mark. I have certainly been drooling slightly over Les' SM (the one that looks like a honeybee) that's he's selling at the moment so I can certainly say that I really admire his work. I am considering the double diagonal Hard Dogs at the moment but I will check out the Boss Frogs. As I was telling Kai last night, the slippery slope has definitely gotten really steep these days. In addition to the rollbar, I've got a long list of 'safety upgrades' such as harnesses, arm restraints, summer tires, brake pads .... (and so on and so forth) ...You're going to laugh if you hear of all the internal monologue/justifications I tell myself each day as I check out these things during my lunch break.

Having said all that, I'm enjoying the fast slide down

cheers,
Ivy

[timmmy]

Ahhhh fabulous, Another victim joins the club

Usually autocross is the gateway drug, I guess you are ts the type to jump right in at the 'Crack' level !

Everyone here has been through and continues to go through the same thing, so please feel free to bounce questions on the forum. You will know you are in trouble when you look at your tire tail trailer for track tires and think......" I need a truck and a trailer, life would be so much easier"

Haydn